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Question Profile
| DATE | Mar 21, 2008 |
| TICKET | #336741 |
| STATUS | Closed |
| SUBJECT | Can't shut down my computer |
| CAT | Computers, Operating Systems, Applications or Connected Devices |
| TYPE | Operating System Features, Bugs and Problems |
| DESC | Apple |
| DESC | 10.3.X (Panther) |
| PLATFORM | Apple Macintosh (PowerPC G3,G4,G5) |
| MODEL | Apple Macintosh Power PC G4 |
| PROC | 400 MHz |
| RAM | 512 |
| DRIVE | 19.12 GB |
| NAME | Tom |
| USERNAME | Tom Maberrry |
| TECHNICAL | Beginner |
| ISSUE | Totally Lost |
Question Details
TICKET ARCHIVE -> Can't shut down my computer
Tom Maberrry - Mar 21, 2008 - 10:48 am
I'm using a 400 MHz Power PC G4 with 512 MB SDRAM & OSX 10.3.9
I was having some problems & ran three different tests First Booted with the Command & S Keys held down. Then typed in /sbin/fsck -fywhen done it said "The volume OSX3 apppears OK. I then booted off the OSX Install Disk and ran the Repair Disk and then Repair Disk Permissions part of the Utilities. One of my problems is that I can't shut down the computer from the Apple drop down menu. I have to press and hold the power button to shut it down. Can anyone think of what else I can do to fix the problem?
Tom
I was having some problems & ran three different tests First Booted with the Command & S Keys held down. Then typed in /sbin/fsck -fywhen done it said "The volume OSX3 apppears OK. I then booted off the OSX Install Disk and ran the Repair Disk and then Repair Disk Permissions part of the Utilities. One of my problems is that I can't shut down the computer from the Apple drop down menu. I have to press and hold the power button to shut it down. Can anyone think of what else I can do to fix the problem?
Tom
earthsaver - Mar 21, 2008 - 5:12 pm
FYI: fsck on the command line is exactly the same as Repair Disk in Disk Utility.
Shut down issues like this are likely due to a problem with the power management unit. You can further test this by spawning the Shut Down dialog (press Control+Eject) and trying to Shut Down from there.
If you need to try resetting the PMU, Apple's instructions are here.
- Ben
Shut down issues like this are likely due to a problem with the power management unit. You can further test this by spawning the Shut Down dialog (press Control+Eject) and trying to Shut Down from there.
If you need to try resetting the PMU, Apple's instructions are here.
- Ben
Tom Maberrry - Mar 22, 2008 - 5:54 pm
-Ben
Thank you for your answer. Being new to this kind of computer repairs I'm kind of woried about doing it myself. Have you ever had to do it?
Tom
Thank you for your answer. Being new to this kind of computer repairs I'm kind of woried about doing it myself. Have you ever had to do it?
Tom
earthsaver - Mar 22, 2008 - 7:30 pm
I don't remember if it was due to a shut down problem like yours, but once or twice in the last four years I've had to reset my PMU. I remember pressing CUDA buttons on machines like yours back in college. It's a pretty simple process. Just make sure you don't press the CUDA button more than once.
The only other effect will be resetting your date, but if you have your date and time set automatically with Apple's time server, then you won't notice a difference after you startup.
The only other effect will be resetting your date, but if you have your date and time set automatically with Apple's time server, then you won't notice a difference after you startup.
Tom Maberrry - Mar 22, 2008 - 9:52 pm
-Ben & earthsaver
When I tried to open Safari to log in to macosx again to let you know I was going to reset my PMU a message came up on the screen that Safari quit. My wife was there also and she told me that Apple's mail program was not working also. She said she tried to sort her e mail by sender but a grey disk came on and just rotated and she could not send or receive mail after that. Does that seem to you to be caused by the PMU or could there be another problem? I just can't believe the problems I'm having with this computer.
Tom
When I tried to open Safari to log in to macosx again to let you know I was going to reset my PMU a message came up on the screen that Safari quit. My wife was there also and she told me that Apple's mail program was not working also. She said she tried to sort her e mail by sender but a grey disk came on and just rotated and she could not send or receive mail after that. Does that seem to you to be caused by the PMU or could there be another problem? I just can't believe the problems I'm having with this computer.
Tom
earthsaver - Mar 22, 2008 - 10:13 pm
Applications crashing is evidence of some system instability that can normally be solved by logging out and back in. Still, I'd like you to reset your PMU before you return to macosx.com to tell me you're going to do it.
Do you use the Graphite interface appearance instead of Blue?, set in the Appearance pane of System Preferences. I've never seen a "gray disk" as you describe, but perhaps that's the Graphite version of the "beachball," as it's known to the Mac world. Just have to force quit the application (can press Command+Option+Escape or choose Force Quit from the Apple menu to open this dialog. Generally, an app will work fine once restarted or after a logout.
You've covered most of your bases otherwise, although a PRAM reset could also be useful. Another test you can try is whether your Mac will shut down from the Login Window, even as it does not from the Desktop.
Do you use the Graphite interface appearance instead of Blue?, set in the Appearance pane of System Preferences. I've never seen a "gray disk" as you describe, but perhaps that's the Graphite version of the "beachball," as it's known to the Mac world. Just have to force quit the application (can press Command+Option+Escape or choose Force Quit from the Apple menu to open this dialog. Generally, an app will work fine once restarted or after a logout.
You've covered most of your bases otherwise, although a PRAM reset could also be useful. Another test you can try is whether your Mac will shut down from the Login Window, even as it does not from the Desktop.
Tom Maberrry - Mar 24, 2008 - 9:01 am
Mac Support
Did not have time to work on the computer Easter Sunday but when I get home tonight I will reset the PMU and post the results if Safari is working. If Safari is not working I will try to get to the wife's office to post the results.
Tom
Did not have time to work on the computer Easter Sunday but when I get home tonight I will reset the PMU and post the results if Safari is working. If Safari is not working I will try to get to the wife's office to post the results.
Tom
Tom Maberrry - Mar 25, 2008 - 8:18 pm
Ben
Sorry I took so long to get back to you. I tried to reset the PMU but nothing seems to have changed. After I restarted the computer I had to change the date & time so I assume I pushed the right button. Do you have any other suggestions. My wife is climbing up my back wanting to use the computer. says I must be doing something wrong but I don't think so.
Tom
Sorry I took so long to get back to you. I tried to reset the PMU but nothing seems to have changed. After I restarted the computer I had to change the date & time so I assume I pushed the right button. Do you have any other suggestions. My wife is climbing up my back wanting to use the computer. says I must be doing something wrong but I don't think so.
Tom
Tom Maberrry - Mar 25, 2008 - 8:23 pm
Ben
By the way were do I find the eject key? I can't find one on my keyboard.
Tom
By the way were do I find the eject key? I can't find one on my keyboard.
Tom
earthsaver - Mar 25, 2008 - 9:14 pm
Old as your computer is, you might not have one. But you have a power key in the upper right, yeah? Control+Eject took it's place when Apple eliminated the power key.
Perhaps it would useful to find out what other problems you were having before this shutdown issue. Also, you might want to try reinstalling 10.3.9. I know it's been a long time, but if you originally installed this update directly from 10.3.8, sometimes installing a combo update can fix these sorts of minor glitches.
Perhaps it would useful to find out what other problems you were having before this shutdown issue. Also, you might want to try reinstalling 10.3.9. I know it's been a long time, but if you originally installed this update directly from 10.3.8, sometimes installing a combo update can fix these sorts of minor glitches.
Tom Maberrry - Mar 26, 2008 - 9:35 am
earthsaver
Thanks for your reply. I'll start out by saying that I don't have an Eject or Power key on the keyboard. It is an Apple keyboard that came with the computer.
Problems with the computer first showed up when my wife asked me to take a look at it because Apple's Mail was stuck on a sort by Name. Bye the way she has about 1,800 E mails in her account. I know before you say so I have told her many times to delete but she dosen't always do it. I tried to delete some but it won't delete them. I then shut down Mail and tried to run Disk Utility's Repair Permissions but it became "Stuck" and after fifteen minutes I had to Force Quit the Utility. If that were not enough I tried to shut down the computer from Apple's drop down menu but the computer did not shut down. There was a black disk of lines that kept rotating on the screen. At that time I did not know that you can shut down the computer by holding down the start button on the front of the computer so I shut off the power at the surge protector switch. I'm really a newbie to the operating system. I always had bobw to call on when there were problems. If there were issues he couldn't tell me how to fix by phone he would come to the house at the drop of a hat, he lived five minutes away. He was a Mac Teck on your site until he passed away. I only have the Install disks for 10.3 and bobw updated with updates from Apple's site. Also if I wipe the disk and reinstall the system I will loose many programs bobw put on my computer for me. Any other sugestions you can come up with would be greatly appreciated.
Tom
Thanks for your reply. I'll start out by saying that I don't have an Eject or Power key on the keyboard. It is an Apple keyboard that came with the computer.
Problems with the computer first showed up when my wife asked me to take a look at it because Apple's Mail was stuck on a sort by Name. Bye the way she has about 1,800 E mails in her account. I know before you say so I have told her many times to delete but she dosen't always do it. I tried to delete some but it won't delete them. I then shut down Mail and tried to run Disk Utility's Repair Permissions but it became "Stuck" and after fifteen minutes I had to Force Quit the Utility. If that were not enough I tried to shut down the computer from Apple's drop down menu but the computer did not shut down. There was a black disk of lines that kept rotating on the screen. At that time I did not know that you can shut down the computer by holding down the start button on the front of the computer so I shut off the power at the surge protector switch. I'm really a newbie to the operating system. I always had bobw to call on when there were problems. If there were issues he couldn't tell me how to fix by phone he would come to the house at the drop of a hat, he lived five minutes away. He was a Mac Teck on your site until he passed away. I only have the Install disks for 10.3 and bobw updated with updates from Apple's site. Also if I wipe the disk and reinstall the system I will loose many programs bobw put on my computer for me. Any other sugestions you can come up with would be greatly appreciated.
Tom
earthsaver - Mar 26, 2008 - 9:55 am
Let's see. 1800 emails really isn't so many that would clog most inboxes, though perhaps so since you're on such a slow computer. I think 5000–10000 is more in that range. The "sunflower" you saw spinning is part of the shutdown process normally, but I guess you waited five minutes with no response so you forced shutdown.
If you choose Archive & Install (with Preserve Users & Network Settings), you will replace only the system files of Mac OS X and everything else, including your applications and data, will be saved. After the reinstall, you'd just run Software Update twice, flanking a restart, to capture all updates available for the system.
All Apple keyboards have either a power or eject key. If you have the Pro keyboard model with navigation and numeric keys on the right side, you have an eject key in the upper right, next to the volume keys.
Reinstalling 10.3.9 by downloading from Apple and installing manually won't hurt anything. It might help. I would try that first.
P.S. Does Restart in the Apple menu work?
If you choose Archive & Install (with Preserve Users & Network Settings), you will replace only the system files of Mac OS X and everything else, including your applications and data, will be saved. After the reinstall, you'd just run Software Update twice, flanking a restart, to capture all updates available for the system.
All Apple keyboards have either a power or eject key. If you have the Pro keyboard model with navigation and numeric keys on the right side, you have an eject key in the upper right, next to the volume keys.
Reinstalling 10.3.9 by downloading from Apple and installing manually won't hurt anything. It might help. I would try that first.
P.S. Does Restart in the Apple menu work?
Tom Maberrry - Mar 26, 2008 - 11:14 am
earthsaver
My keyboard is divided into two sections. Letters,on the bottom numbers above and Underscore Key, + = Key & Delete Key. On top the escape key on the left and F1 thru F12 running to the right. On the left section is the numeric keys with an enter key above the number keys isnum lock +clear, =,/,* above is help, home, pg up and pg dn. I seem to remember bobw commenting about the keyboard when he first saw it also.
I can't remember if Restart worked or if i had to shut down with power button and use the power button & C key when I booted off the Install CD. I'll try it tonight when I get home.
I assume when you say Archive & Install (with Preserve Users & Network Settings), your talking about having the computer booted off the Install CD. Please remember I am really a NEWBE to all of this. Can you give me a step by step work up of what to do?
Tom
My keyboard is divided into two sections. Letters,on the bottom numbers above and Underscore Key, + = Key & Delete Key. On top the escape key on the left and F1 thru F12 running to the right. On the left section is the numeric keys with an enter key above the number keys isnum lock +clear, =,/,* above is help, home, pg up and pg dn. I seem to remember bobw commenting about the keyboard when he first saw it also.
I can't remember if Restart worked or if i had to shut down with power button and use the power button & C key when I booted off the Install CD. I'll try it tonight when I get home.
I assume when you say Archive & Install (with Preserve Users & Network Settings), your talking about having the computer booted off the Install CD. Please remember I am really a NEWBE to all of this. Can you give me a step by step work up of what to do?
Tom
Tom Maberrry - Mar 26, 2008 - 12:31 pm
earthsaver
Just a few questions in my NEWBE mind. Were will I find Archive & Install, Does HD have to be wiped or X ed out, will E mail account be preserved, address book saved??? I have never done anything like this. I watched bobw when he set up this computer BUT he worked so fast I could not remember anything about how he went about it. I tried to ask questions but he just laughed and did not seem to want to slow down.
Tom
Just a few questions in my NEWBE mind. Were will I find Archive & Install, Does HD have to be wiped or X ed out, will E mail account be preserved, address book saved??? I have never done anything like this. I watched bobw when he set up this computer BUT he worked so fast I could not remember anything about how he went about it. I tried to ask questions but he just laughed and did not seem to want to slow down.
Tom
earthsaver - Mar 26, 2008 - 10:16 pm
When you startup from the install disc, when you select the destination volume, there is an Options button where you can (or must) choose Upgrade, Archive & Install, or Erase & Install. The installer clarifies the result of each of these choices pretty clearly. Preserving your user account(s) will, naturally, preserve all of your personal data. The only way to erase your hard disk as part of this process is to honestly choose Erase & Install.
So, you have the older version of Apple keyboard like this one, right? See that power key above the top row on the right side?
So, you have the older version of Apple keyboard like this one, right? See that power key above the top row on the right side?
Tom Maberrry - Mar 27, 2008 - 9:28 am
earthsaver
Am I ever embarrased. I've spent years on this keyboard and never noticed the power button! You are really giving me an education on Mac.
You're directions seem easy enough to follow. I don't think I'll have the time to do it tonight but Friday night looks good to work on it. By the way will I need a registration number to do it? I can't seem to find one. I usually write it down on a lable attached to the CD case but it's not on any of the three OSX cases.
Am I ever embarrased. I've spent years on this keyboard and never noticed the power button! You are really giving me an education on Mac.
You're directions seem easy enough to follow. I don't think I'll have the time to do it tonight but Friday night looks good to work on it. By the way will I need a registration number to do it? I can't seem to find one. I usually write it down on a lable attached to the CD case but it's not on any of the three OSX cases.
earthsaver - Mar 27, 2008 - 9:49 am
Your usual behavior stands. Never has there been a registration/license code associated with Mac OS.
Tom Maberrry - Mar 27, 2008 - 10:19 am
earthsaver
Thank you for your quick response. I never had to install an OS. Just some 3 rd party software like Filemaker & Quicken which do require a license. I'll learn though.
Tom
Thank you for your quick response. I never had to install an OS. Just some 3 rd party software like Filemaker & Quicken which do require a license. I'll learn though.
Tom
Tom Maberrry - Mar 29, 2008 - 12:43 pm
earthsaver
Everything went like clockwork until I tried to install disk 3. The computer asked for a password and I have never had to enter a password before. The third CD contains an " Install CD3 mpkg file. I have tried every password I normally use and non of them work. Is there anything I can do short of a clean Install so that I can save the 3rd party programs? I only have a read only CD on the computer and a 250 MB Zip disk is what I use for backup. I don't know how to make a restore CD. Maybe it's me, I thought that I was starting to learn something about computers but for every step forward I take I run into other problems and seem to fall back three steps! So far as I can see everything else is working. The computer starts up and I used the Apple dropdown menu to restart and shut down.
Tom
Everything went like clockwork until I tried to install disk 3. The computer asked for a password and I have never had to enter a password before. The third CD contains an " Install CD3 mpkg file. I have tried every password I normally use and non of them work. Is there anything I can do short of a clean Install so that I can save the 3rd party programs? I only have a read only CD on the computer and a 250 MB Zip disk is what I use for backup. I don't know how to make a restore CD. Maybe it's me, I thought that I was starting to learn something about computers but for every step forward I take I run into other problems and seem to fall back three steps! So far as I can see everything else is working. The computer starts up and I used the Apple dropdown menu to restart and shut down.
Tom
Tom Maberrry - Mar 29, 2008 - 3:54 pm
earthsaver
Please disregard the previous message. After calming down I went back to trying every password I could think of and somhow came up with the right one. Everything seems to be working ok so far. We just have to watch our granddaughter more closely when she is on it. I can't thank you enough for your help.
Tom
Please disregard the previous message. After calming down I went back to trying every password I could think of and somhow came up with the right one. Everything seems to be working ok so far. We just have to watch our granddaughter more closely when she is on it. I can't thank you enough for your help.
Tom
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