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TICKET ARCHIVE -> File sorting - how to label in Finder

RobinS - Mar 2, 2006 - 7:30 pm

I need to control the order of my files/folders so I have to override the natural tendency of alphabetical sorting. Can I turn alphabetical sorting off? It would be great to be able to drag things in the order I choose (like in youir Mail accounts) instead of being trapped by this sorting method. I can put spaces or other symbols (`#$) in front of the name or just numbers (only works up to 9 of course) but it would be oh so much better to abolish this alphabetical sorting from the start.
The more I think of it, the more logical this is - what's the chance the alphabet is going to be in the same order as a user's preference? Probably about 1 in 26 for each file/folder.

amrcnidt961 - Mar 2, 2006 - 7:37 pm

When you are viewing the folder that you want to turn the alphabetical sorting off for, Either type Command+J or go to View>>Show View Options. From there, make sure the radio button for "This Window Only" is selected, not the "All Windows" one (unless you want to make all windows do this). Then, uncheck the "Keep Arranged By" box, and check the box that says "Snap to Grid". From that point forward, the icons will stay in a grid, but you will be able to move them to other spots in the folder freely.

Have a nice Day,
Joey Lange
macosx.com Volunteer

RobinS - Mar 2, 2006 - 10:06 pm

I didn't think anyone every used Icons except maybe when you first turn on a computer. I can't even understand why they even install Icon View in the Finder. Why would anyone use it when they take up so much room? Are there really any advantages? List or Column View shows so much more. (Except for the ability to turn Alphabetical sorting off I guess!)

As I started reading my hopes were raised - only to realize that in Column view there are no options for anything but:
Show icons
Show preview column.

Any other ideas?

amrcnidt961 - Mar 2, 2006 - 11:25 pm

I didn't know you were using column view. Sorry.
If that is the case, then I will reopen the topic to the pool.

Apologies, and Regards,
Joey Lange
macosx.com Volunteer

DeltaMac - Mar 3, 2006 - 7:27 am

Here's what I use on some folders:
Icon view, and change the setting to Turn Off Snap to Grid, move to Icon Size slider to the minimum position. Select all files, and click on View menu, choosing cleanup. This will put all your files in a sort of column/list. Now you can move any file to any position, create physical groups for organizing without regard to any artificial sorting provided by the Finder, etc.

- Dale

RobinS - Mar 3, 2006 - 11:21 am

I have up to 100 files in a folder. Often many folders in a folder. I have to see most of the contents of a folder in 1 page. Icon View wastes space. I will never understand the Finder. Please put this back in the pool.

DeltaMac - Mar 3, 2006 - 11:48 am

With the tip that I describe (and at the smallest icon setting) you can have several hundred icons displayed in one window, with the capability to arrange in any type of organization that you want, and without regard to any limitation for sorting. (This is no space waster - if you tried it, you would see what I am describing)
Yes, you can't see inside folders without opening that folder.

Maybe the QuickSilver software will allow you to do what you are asking about. (I haven't used QuickSilver, but many Mac users think it's great!)

- Dale

RobinS - Mar 3, 2006 - 12:01 pm

I also need to see longer file names. Icon view truncates the names. Can't I use List View, and spread the column to the page width? I can't seem to drag the column to more than half the width of the page. What are they saving the other half for? Its totally wasted. Who designs this stuff? Maybe there is no drug policy at Apple. At least that would explain the absurd lack of logic in their software execution. Maybe there is no left brain thinking there at all.

Why does OS X windows CONSTANTLY:
Open in small windows?
Never have a maximize command to so the window opens in full page view consistantly?
Columns can't resize to fit widest file name?
Columns can't remember their size?
And on and on. Methinks Apple designers read a magazine by only turning over 1/4 of a page at a time. We wouldn't want to show the whole page! That would be logical. No, lets scatter a whole pile of little windows all over the screen, none showing their full contents and if they do by chance perform that remarkable feat, are instanly too small once you move in to the next column or folder because the program said "This size is fine - you will never need anything bigger."

"640k should be large enough for anybody".....well apparently Bill didn't say that after all, but its the same head-in-the-sand mentality.

Why didn't I learn Linux when I was younger?

RobinS - Mar 3, 2006 - 12:13 pm

I tried the Icon view. Way too much wasted space. Thanks for the tip anyway. Please throw this back in the pool.

DeltaMac - Mar 3, 2006 - 1:08 pm

I can't disagree more on the 'small page' that you refer to.
There is a minimal window size, which may be a system default.
Open your desired window, open the View Options, and make sure that This Window Only is selected, then close options. Resize your window to the desired size and position, and CLOSE the window as the next step.
Re-opening that same window will show your window in that same desired size and position. This is similar to how the Finder has always functioned back to System 7 or thereabouts.
When using this approach, returning to that same window will result in the size and position as you left it...
Most who study this issue, come to the conclusion that Apple never felt the need to 'Zoom' out to fill the screen, unless the document and app supported it, So, this continues, with that full screen approach supported on apps that can use it, and not simply to make some window full screen whenever one clicks 'Zoom' - a much more useful approach than the shotgun approach that MS Win uses, don't you agree?
At your request, I will return this to the pool - thanks for your kind indulgence - I hope I can answer a better question for you later!
- Dale

RobinS - Mar 5, 2006 - 3:03 pm

The "small page" is all well and fine IF IT GOT BIGGER AS THE CONTENTS GOT BIGGER, but of course it doesn't. How many times do you open a page only to roam through it, needing more space. Then you have to drag the bottom right hand corner to enlarge it. Total absurdity - unless I'm missing something and if so, please let me know.

I'd love to have a default full screen or max window size (Alt+Spacebar+X in Windows) for ALL apps then have the ability to decrease its size if its warranted. Since that only happens about 2% of the time, you can see the logic. Unfortunately logic is in very short supply at the Apple factory.

ishan - Mar 5, 2006 - 7:41 pm

Your idea that every app should open to default full screen may work for you, since you need to see other windows simultaneously "about 2% of the time." However, for other users, those who are running multiple apps, particularly on a large screen, covering up all other windows by launching another app means having to a) make the window smaller or b) hiding the window you just opened temporarily to access another app's window or c) changing to another app via the keyboard so that the other app's window is frontmost.

The behavior you prefer is one of the most annoying things I find about using Windows-based PCs. I am not saying Apple's solution is the most "logical" or better, but that Apple has to take the preferences of a wide range of users into account. There have been–and continue to be–endless arguments about the Windows vs. Mac GUI. Let's leave that for another time and place.

RobinS - Mar 6, 2006 - 11:10 am

I think one problem with the "covering up of windows" worry is that very few Mac users use Command+Tab to switch between windows. I guess that the c) "changing to another app via the keyboard" you mention. As long as you're right handed (or remap the keys if you're left handed) switching apps is almost instantaneous. If you're using the mouse of course, its terribly tedious if you're doing that hundreds of times a day. Mac people rarely seem to realize how limiting the mouse is and its only function is as a crutch, until people can use keyboard shortcuts. If you're not doing something often, of course use the mouse. But most people don't bother learning keyboard shortcuts, so their speed on their computer is very limiting to their work.

Re: Windows vs Mac.......I use advantages to each. What I find incredulous is they are too prideful to admit learning from each other. In a perfect world, the Mac OS would interface to the net, and run as many programs as possible. The Windows OS would run the rest, never seeing the internet for obvious reasons. Commands/mouse functions would be identical on each. There is absolutely no point in learning something new that does exactly the same thing you've been doing before. But they will probably never grasp this.

If Apple ever gets rid of Steve Jobs, maybe they'll come out with a Windows skin with logic like a Start button and a great file organizer like Windows Explorer. But until then, there's too much ego there to really make inroads in getting the Mac OS to a mainstream audience.