Ticket Options
Question Profile
| DATE | Oct 26, 2006 |
| TICKET | #330002 |
| STATUS | Closed |
| SUBJECT | Mac OS X Dual Boot with Vista |
| CAT | Computers, Operating Systems, Applications or Connected Devices |
| TYPE | Operating System Features, Bugs and Problems |
| DESC | Apple |
| DESC | 10.3.X (Panther) |
| PLATFORM | All Other Brand Computers Running Intel |
| MODEL | P III |
| PROC | |
| RAM | |
| DRIVE | |
| NAME | Stephen |
| USERNAME | davenport80 |
| TECHNICAL | Little Experience |
| ISSUE | Just Started Looking |
Question Details
TICKET ARCHIVE -> Mac OS X Dual Boot with Vista
davenport80 - Oct 26, 2006 - 5:22 pm
I just recently updated to Vista, and I found a boot loader that will allow me to switch between OS X and Vista on an Intel based machine. I have Vista running I just heard that I had to get some update to install OS X onto this intel machine. Do you know where I can find this update for intel. I have been looking high and low. I am really excited about having OS X on my intel and this is what is slowing me down.
- Oct 27, 2006 - 2:41 am
Hi Stephen,
Your ticket says that you are using 10.3.x which is OS X Panther. To boot Windows XP SP2 or VIsta, you need to be running at least OS X Tiger 10.4.6 or greater.
The only bootloader that you should be attempting is Apple's official bootcamp.
http://www.apple.com/bootcamp
Even it is still in BETA and is not 100% trouble free.
Hopefully this is the bootloader you are referring to.
You should read through all of the bootcamp info at the link above.
Additionally, you will need to have the latest firmware update on your Mac, which you can get more info about here. Be VERY careful about flashing the firmware. Follow the instructions very carefully.
http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=303364
-jonathan
Your ticket says that you are using 10.3.x which is OS X Panther. To boot Windows XP SP2 or VIsta, you need to be running at least OS X Tiger 10.4.6 or greater.
The only bootloader that you should be attempting is Apple's official bootcamp.
http://www.apple.com/bootcamp
Even it is still in BETA and is not 100% trouble free.
Hopefully this is the bootloader you are referring to.
You should read through all of the bootcamp info at the link above.
Additionally, you will need to have the latest firmware update on your Mac, which you can get more info about here. Be VERY careful about flashing the firmware. Follow the instructions very carefully.
http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=303364
-jonathan
stottm - Oct 27, 2006 - 6:56 am
I don't believe that Jonathan picked up on the fact that you are asking how to boot OS X on a non-Mac Intel based computer.
1. Apple is not currently shipping Intel compatible versions of Mac OS X installation CD's unless you bought a new Intel Mac. i.e. you can't at this time buy an Intel version of Mac OS X without buying an Intel Mac.
2. Apple's Intel Mac's have special TPM chips that the Intel Mac OS X version look for while booting. If the chip is not there and the encrypted Apple signature is not there it will not boot. i.e. Apple does not want you to boot Mac OS X on non-Apple hardware.
3. Apples hardware support is very sparse. i.e. even if you did get a pirated Intel version of Mac OS X to boot it would likely have all sorts of problems with your hardware. Unless you are running something extremely close to an Intel Mac you will have serious stability issues and a lot of hardware will not be detected. Apple does not include drivers for hardware they don't actually use.
4. It is illegal. You would have to steal the OS from someone who purchased it with a new Mac or you would have to obtain a pirated copy of the Intel Mac OS X beta which has already expired.
I heard what you heard and I looked into it. The OSX X86 hackers had the developers release of Intel Mac OS X booting on non-Mac hardware. This was before Apple had released an Intel Mac to the public. Apple leased temporary development machines to licensed Apple Developers and gave them the install media that was in beta. Once Apple released the actual production Intel Mac's they included a TPM chip which prevents OSX from booting on non-Apple Intel PC's. i.e. it won't see the chip nor the signature and it won't boot. The latest reported success in getting it to work involved hacking the TPM code with a binary hex editor. The author of the hack did not publish what he did to make it work. He hinted at it, but that was all. The hackers are rightfully worried about Apple legal going after them if they publish the hack to the public. Besides, when Intel Leopard (10.5) ships, it will probably have even more obstacles to overcome in order to run on a non-Mac. Apple could force their Mac customers to update their EFI firmware in order to run the new Leopard release. They could put the EFI firmware right on the Leopard DVD. EFI is not available on x86 platforms and probably won't be for years.
Bottom line, just buy a Mac... Seriously, you won't regret it. It will dual boot WinXP and Vista. Some are triple booting Linux as well. You can buy Parallels (like VMWare for a Mac) and run WinXP and Vista in virtual machines that run at native speed.
I've been computing for decades. I've run just about everything from mainframes to the early Texas Instrument personal computers. I've bought 3 Mac's that sit beside my Sun SPARC workstations and multiple PC's running Linux and various Windows versions, including the latest Vista RC beta. Without a shadow of a doubt, my favorite computers are the Mac's and they have become my main workstations.
Start with a Mac Mini if cost is a concern or try a MacBook, my coworker just bought one and it blew his mind as he just bought a Dell laptop at the same time (his wife's). He's had nothing but trouble with the Dell and it ended up going back for warranty replacement. The MacBook out of the box was up and running in 15 minutes and he stated he would have paid $1000 more for it had he truly known just how good it was. He's just about ready to tell Dell he wants his money back as his wife is really digging OS X as they wait on Dell to replace their defective laptop.
OS X is so much better then WinXP or Vista that it's not even funny... If you know anything about programming you get the entire programmer toolset for free! All the compilers, IDE's, API's, Documentation, Unix command line tools, scripting (AppleScript, Perl, Python, Ruby, Bash, etc., etc.). This would cost you thousands of dollars to get the same thing from Microsoft; MSDN subscription, etc.
I came to Apple from the Linux world. I would never have bought an Apple if it was shipping with Mac OS 9 or prior. I had run NeXT years ago and knew how good it was. As soon as I heard Apple bought NeXT and they had an early release 10.0.x I was drooling over it. Imagined running Photoshop, MS Office, and still be able to run all the open source Linux software and development tools. When it hit 10.1 and was officially shipping installed on new Mac's I spent 4 hours in an Apple store playing with it and picking the salesmen's brain. I walked out with an Apple PowerBook G4. I've never looked back. When 10.2 shipped I stood in line for hours to get a free t-shirt and 20% off all items in the store for the midnight release party. I ended up buying two more Mac's over the years.
Yeah, the hardware costs a lot more in many cases. But the engineering is high quality. Sure it's the same components but the case design is so much better. Just look at the innards of the MacPro, you can't see any cabling at all, it's all hidden. The true value is the operating system combined with hardware all from the same vendor. This ensures stability. The reason so many have problems with Windows is the multitude of hardware and drivers not to mention the security flaws inherent to Windows.
Mac's truly "Just Work" - I fix computers all day long, I don't want to come home and fix my own computers. I gave my wife a Mac and she rarely needs to ask me for help. My father still has a PC and I still have to help him with it. All I can say is, thank God for Putty & UltraVNC! I can securely tunnel through his firewall into his PC with SSH 2048 bit public/private keys encrypted with BlowFish and forward the VNC port through my router to my Mac and remote control his screen for free! When his PC gets old, I'll be buying him a Mac and I won't have to install UltraVNC and Putty to do it!
1. Apple is not currently shipping Intel compatible versions of Mac OS X installation CD's unless you bought a new Intel Mac. i.e. you can't at this time buy an Intel version of Mac OS X without buying an Intel Mac.
2. Apple's Intel Mac's have special TPM chips that the Intel Mac OS X version look for while booting. If the chip is not there and the encrypted Apple signature is not there it will not boot. i.e. Apple does not want you to boot Mac OS X on non-Apple hardware.
3. Apples hardware support is very sparse. i.e. even if you did get a pirated Intel version of Mac OS X to boot it would likely have all sorts of problems with your hardware. Unless you are running something extremely close to an Intel Mac you will have serious stability issues and a lot of hardware will not be detected. Apple does not include drivers for hardware they don't actually use.
4. It is illegal. You would have to steal the OS from someone who purchased it with a new Mac or you would have to obtain a pirated copy of the Intel Mac OS X beta which has already expired.
I heard what you heard and I looked into it. The OSX X86 hackers had the developers release of Intel Mac OS X booting on non-Mac hardware. This was before Apple had released an Intel Mac to the public. Apple leased temporary development machines to licensed Apple Developers and gave them the install media that was in beta. Once Apple released the actual production Intel Mac's they included a TPM chip which prevents OSX from booting on non-Apple Intel PC's. i.e. it won't see the chip nor the signature and it won't boot. The latest reported success in getting it to work involved hacking the TPM code with a binary hex editor. The author of the hack did not publish what he did to make it work. He hinted at it, but that was all. The hackers are rightfully worried about Apple legal going after them if they publish the hack to the public. Besides, when Intel Leopard (10.5) ships, it will probably have even more obstacles to overcome in order to run on a non-Mac. Apple could force their Mac customers to update their EFI firmware in order to run the new Leopard release. They could put the EFI firmware right on the Leopard DVD. EFI is not available on x86 platforms and probably won't be for years.
Bottom line, just buy a Mac... Seriously, you won't regret it. It will dual boot WinXP and Vista. Some are triple booting Linux as well. You can buy Parallels (like VMWare for a Mac) and run WinXP and Vista in virtual machines that run at native speed.
I've been computing for decades. I've run just about everything from mainframes to the early Texas Instrument personal computers. I've bought 3 Mac's that sit beside my Sun SPARC workstations and multiple PC's running Linux and various Windows versions, including the latest Vista RC beta. Without a shadow of a doubt, my favorite computers are the Mac's and they have become my main workstations.
Start with a Mac Mini if cost is a concern or try a MacBook, my coworker just bought one and it blew his mind as he just bought a Dell laptop at the same time (his wife's). He's had nothing but trouble with the Dell and it ended up going back for warranty replacement. The MacBook out of the box was up and running in 15 minutes and he stated he would have paid $1000 more for it had he truly known just how good it was. He's just about ready to tell Dell he wants his money back as his wife is really digging OS X as they wait on Dell to replace their defective laptop.
OS X is so much better then WinXP or Vista that it's not even funny... If you know anything about programming you get the entire programmer toolset for free! All the compilers, IDE's, API's, Documentation, Unix command line tools, scripting (AppleScript, Perl, Python, Ruby, Bash, etc., etc.). This would cost you thousands of dollars to get the same thing from Microsoft; MSDN subscription, etc.
I came to Apple from the Linux world. I would never have bought an Apple if it was shipping with Mac OS 9 or prior. I had run NeXT years ago and knew how good it was. As soon as I heard Apple bought NeXT and they had an early release 10.0.x I was drooling over it. Imagined running Photoshop, MS Office, and still be able to run all the open source Linux software and development tools. When it hit 10.1 and was officially shipping installed on new Mac's I spent 4 hours in an Apple store playing with it and picking the salesmen's brain. I walked out with an Apple PowerBook G4. I've never looked back. When 10.2 shipped I stood in line for hours to get a free t-shirt and 20% off all items in the store for the midnight release party. I ended up buying two more Mac's over the years.
Yeah, the hardware costs a lot more in many cases. But the engineering is high quality. Sure it's the same components but the case design is so much better. Just look at the innards of the MacPro, you can't see any cabling at all, it's all hidden. The true value is the operating system combined with hardware all from the same vendor. This ensures stability. The reason so many have problems with Windows is the multitude of hardware and drivers not to mention the security flaws inherent to Windows.
Mac's truly "Just Work" - I fix computers all day long, I don't want to come home and fix my own computers. I gave my wife a Mac and she rarely needs to ask me for help. My father still has a PC and I still have to help him with it. All I can say is, thank God for Putty & UltraVNC! I can securely tunnel through his firewall into his PC with SSH 2048 bit public/private keys encrypted with BlowFish and forward the VNC port through my router to my Mac and remote control his screen for free! When his PC gets old, I'll be buying him a Mac and I won't have to install UltraVNC and Putty to do it!
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