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TICKET ARCHIVE -> Peer to Peer Mac Osx With Win Xp
ckai - Jul 24, 2005 - 10:50 pm
Hi there,
Had a deep look through the forum about this issue but couldn't find any help that I haven't already tried (at least I'm pretty sure I haven't). If there is anything out there that fixes my issue just point in in the right direction.
Right, we have just purchased a imac G5 last week after being strict windows people and we were told it would be easy to network it into our existing windows network.
Now the network is quite unique in the way that we have a wireless router that we use as a 'hub' since we only have dial-up (haven't got around to upgrading to broadband). We use a Win XP computer to dial up and share the internet to any computers that join the network
All up we only have 3 computers - 2 running XP and the G5. After stuffing around for some time to get the G5 to join the network I decided I'd try a simple wireless peer to peer with the XP running the internet and the G5. But just can't get it to find each other.
The closest I've come is to have the G5 show up in the workgroup of the XP but not being able to access it by changing the workgroup on the G5 to it's own instead of the Windows workgroup of "homeoffice".
I thought I would do one step at a time and try to access the files on each computer first then I can move onto getting internet access on the G5.
Any help would be fantastic and I'm flexible with how it will be set up, i.e. if G5 is better to have the internet access and XP get it from the mac then fine.(as you will probably notice by us switching from the "hub" to peer to peer). I just need it to work :-) Not a good first Mac experience LOL
Cheers
Cameron
Had a deep look through the forum about this issue but couldn't find any help that I haven't already tried (at least I'm pretty sure I haven't). If there is anything out there that fixes my issue just point in in the right direction.
Right, we have just purchased a imac G5 last week after being strict windows people and we were told it would be easy to network it into our existing windows network.
Now the network is quite unique in the way that we have a wireless router that we use as a 'hub' since we only have dial-up (haven't got around to upgrading to broadband). We use a Win XP computer to dial up and share the internet to any computers that join the network
All up we only have 3 computers - 2 running XP and the G5. After stuffing around for some time to get the G5 to join the network I decided I'd try a simple wireless peer to peer with the XP running the internet and the G5. But just can't get it to find each other.
The closest I've come is to have the G5 show up in the workgroup of the XP but not being able to access it by changing the workgroup on the G5 to it's own instead of the Windows workgroup of "homeoffice".
I thought I would do one step at a time and try to access the files on each computer first then I can move onto getting internet access on the G5.
Any help would be fantastic and I'm flexible with how it will be set up, i.e. if G5 is better to have the internet access and XP get it from the mac then fine.(as you will probably notice by us switching from the "hub" to peer to peer). I just need it to work :-) Not a good first Mac experience LOL
Cheers
Cameron
ckai - Jul 24, 2005 - 11:00 pm
I have to appologize, I forgot to mention that the peer to peer I'm trying to set up is using wireless (thought it would be easier).
I was a little too eager to get this sorted!
Cameron
I was a little too eager to get this sorted!
Cameron
baldprof - Jul 25, 2005 - 8:31 pm
I don't know if I can help you or not, since as you say, your network is a bit unusual. Sharing a dialup connnection? Shudder!
Anyway, if I understand you correctly, you have a phone line connected to a mode/wireless router combo, and you have several computers that want to connect wirelessly? If so that is unusual.
Normally if you were using internet connection sharing, you would have one computer connected to a phone line via it's modem. You would then enable internet connection sharing on that computer. That computer in effect becomes the router, which will then assign IP address to any sharing computers, and you have to connect any connection sharing computers to it, in this case wirelessly.
The next step would be to set up each computer with a wireless adapter to operate in ad hoc mode, where they communicate with each other directly, without the use of a router as an intermediary. But you would also set up each computer, except the one acting as the base, to accept the IP address assigned by the base using DHCP.
But apparently you have a wireless router that contains a modem, and you want to use that to establish a dial up connection which will be shared. Hmm. I didn't think that was possible. (As you will see why below) Oh well.
If you are going to use the wireless router, you need to be aware that the default is for it to assign IP addresses using DHCP. You should make sure that all computers then are set to accept IP address assigned using DHCP. I am not in front of my XP box, so I can't tell you how to do that in XP. Ditto for making sure that they are in "infrastructure as opposed to ad hoc mode. You are also going to have to set them up to establish a connection through that router. How to do that depends on the router.
On your Mac, you start by opening System Preferences. That's the thing in the dock that looks like a light switch. Then assuming you have the Airport card already setup properly, make sure it is set to use the Airport to make the connection. Then click Configure. Click the TCP/IP button.
Where it says Configure IPv4, make sure it is set to use DHCP. Then click Apply now if you have had to make any changes. Then open System Preferencesw again, and click Sharing. Then if you you wish to share files, make sure that you have checked Personal File Sharing, and Windows File Sharing.( Now click the Internet button; if you explore this pane you will note that Macs can share an internet connection with other computers, but only if the connect was made by the Mac via a cable. So if you could connect your Mac to your router via ethernet, you could use it to share the connection.)
You would also have to make sure that the Airport card was set to operate in "infrastructure mode" as opposed to ad hoc mode.
But here's the thing, even Apple's own Airport base Stations, which have a modem, allow only one computer to establish a dialup connection at a time.
The connection is not shared. I just don't think you can have shared acccess the way you want.
Anyway, if I understand you correctly, you have a phone line connected to a mode/wireless router combo, and you have several computers that want to connect wirelessly? If so that is unusual.
Normally if you were using internet connection sharing, you would have one computer connected to a phone line via it's modem. You would then enable internet connection sharing on that computer. That computer in effect becomes the router, which will then assign IP address to any sharing computers, and you have to connect any connection sharing computers to it, in this case wirelessly.
The next step would be to set up each computer with a wireless adapter to operate in ad hoc mode, where they communicate with each other directly, without the use of a router as an intermediary. But you would also set up each computer, except the one acting as the base, to accept the IP address assigned by the base using DHCP.
But apparently you have a wireless router that contains a modem, and you want to use that to establish a dial up connection which will be shared. Hmm. I didn't think that was possible. (As you will see why below) Oh well.
If you are going to use the wireless router, you need to be aware that the default is for it to assign IP addresses using DHCP. You should make sure that all computers then are set to accept IP address assigned using DHCP. I am not in front of my XP box, so I can't tell you how to do that in XP. Ditto for making sure that they are in "infrastructure as opposed to ad hoc mode. You are also going to have to set them up to establish a connection through that router. How to do that depends on the router.
On your Mac, you start by opening System Preferences. That's the thing in the dock that looks like a light switch. Then assuming you have the Airport card already setup properly, make sure it is set to use the Airport to make the connection. Then click Configure. Click the TCP/IP button.
Where it says Configure IPv4, make sure it is set to use DHCP. Then click Apply now if you have had to make any changes. Then open System Preferencesw again, and click Sharing. Then if you you wish to share files, make sure that you have checked Personal File Sharing, and Windows File Sharing.( Now click the Internet button; if you explore this pane you will note that Macs can share an internet connection with other computers, but only if the connect was made by the Mac via a cable. So if you could connect your Mac to your router via ethernet, you could use it to share the connection.)
You would also have to make sure that the Airport card was set to operate in "infrastructure mode" as opposed to ad hoc mode.
But here's the thing, even Apple's own Airport base Stations, which have a modem, allow only one computer to establish a dialup connection at a time.
The connection is not shared. I just don't think you can have shared acccess the way you want.
ckai - Jul 26, 2005 - 1:40 am
Cheers Michael,
I obviously wrote something that was very much crap and you got the wrong idea. Sorry about that. You are spot on when you said we want to connect to the 'net using an XP computer with a dial-up modem. We want the setup to go something like this:
- XP computer has dial-up modem to connect to net
- XP computer connects via LAN to Linksys wireless router
- Mac uses router (via Airport) to access Xp computer's dial up connection (and of course files on XP computer)
- Any other computer can access the same dial-up connection via the router by either wireless or LAN cable. Also join the network and share files
I worked out today that my peer-to-peer idea isn't really the way to go since it will greatly limit other computers joining the network. So thank you for ignoring it and going with our original setup :-)
Thank you for so easily clearing up the fact that the XP computer with the dial-up acts as a router and assigns the IPs.
We can access and share the dial up of the XP computer if we plug in our laptop (also XP) to the LAN (via the router) ro by the wireless adapter. We still can't do anything with the Mac, even after taking your advise and making some changes.
It appears the XP computer isn't assigning a 'good' IP address to it that is along the same lines as those that the laptop gets given. For example the laptop's allocated IP is 192.168.0.... with the subnet the same as the computer with the dial up connection. Where as the Mac has an IP starting with 169.254... and the subnet is different!!
This wouldn't have anything to do with the workgroup the Mac is on? I'm assuming if if the Mac got given the right IP address etc then we would be sweet.
Any ideas? Sorry if I wasted your time with my naf explaination the first time around.
Cameron
I obviously wrote something that was very much crap and you got the wrong idea. Sorry about that. You are spot on when you said we want to connect to the 'net using an XP computer with a dial-up modem. We want the setup to go something like this:
- XP computer has dial-up modem to connect to net
- XP computer connects via LAN to Linksys wireless router
- Mac uses router (via Airport) to access Xp computer's dial up connection (and of course files on XP computer)
- Any other computer can access the same dial-up connection via the router by either wireless or LAN cable. Also join the network and share files
I worked out today that my peer-to-peer idea isn't really the way to go since it will greatly limit other computers joining the network. So thank you for ignoring it and going with our original setup :-)
Thank you for so easily clearing up the fact that the XP computer with the dial-up acts as a router and assigns the IPs.
We can access and share the dial up of the XP computer if we plug in our laptop (also XP) to the LAN (via the router) ro by the wireless adapter. We still can't do anything with the Mac, even after taking your advise and making some changes.
It appears the XP computer isn't assigning a 'good' IP address to it that is along the same lines as those that the laptop gets given. For example the laptop's allocated IP is 192.168.0.... with the subnet the same as the computer with the dial up connection. Where as the Mac has an IP starting with 169.254... and the subnet is different!!
This wouldn't have anything to do with the workgroup the Mac is on? I'm assuming if if the Mac got given the right IP address etc then we would be sweet.
Any ideas? Sorry if I wasted your time with my naf explaination the first time around.
Cameron
baldprof - Jul 26, 2005 - 6:25 am
Okay, now I have a clearer understanding of the problem.
There's one thing to try which is to connect the mac directly to the router using ethernet. By now you know where the network preferences are. After connecting the ethernet, power on the Mac. Now open the System Preferences, then the Network Preferences. Now set it to use the built-in ethernet. Then click Configure, Make sure the location is set to Automatic, and Show is set to buitlin Ethernet.Now make sure it is set to use DHCP, and tell it to renew the DHCP lease. Is the IP address in the proper range? It should be. Oh yea, you may need to temporarily turn Airport off to get this to work right. Of course you will need to click Apply Changes.
Once the ethernet connection is setup, then open the sharing preferences to make sure those are set properly as I mentioned before. You can share whatever is in the main public Documents folder on your Mac.
NOw, close System Preferences. Open the Finder (the thing with the Mac face in the dock. Click the Network icon. Can your Mac see the other computers? If that have the sharing setup properly, you should be able to.
On your PCs, you may need to go throough the "add Network Place" thing. For the location you will need to use the IP address that was assigned to the Mac.
If everything looks fine, or at least better than it did (LOL!), then you can address the Airport issue.
So how does it look at this point?
One thing I would like to recommend is the following book:
Mac OS X tiger Edition, The Missing Manual. The author is David Pogue, and it is part of the O'Reilly Press series. There are even screen shots of the way to setup XP computers to connect to Macs.
As far as the Airport is concerned: first, shut down your Mac and disconnect the ethernet. Now power on your Mac. Turn on Airport again, and open System Preferences. Make sure it is set to use Airport. Now click configure. Make sure it shows the Airport card settings, then set all the settings as before regarding DHCP and so on. That should do it.
There's one thing to try which is to connect the mac directly to the router using ethernet. By now you know where the network preferences are. After connecting the ethernet, power on the Mac. Now open the System Preferences, then the Network Preferences. Now set it to use the built-in ethernet. Then click Configure, Make sure the location is set to Automatic, and Show is set to buitlin Ethernet.Now make sure it is set to use DHCP, and tell it to renew the DHCP lease. Is the IP address in the proper range? It should be. Oh yea, you may need to temporarily turn Airport off to get this to work right. Of course you will need to click Apply Changes.
Once the ethernet connection is setup, then open the sharing preferences to make sure those are set properly as I mentioned before. You can share whatever is in the main public Documents folder on your Mac.
NOw, close System Preferences. Open the Finder (the thing with the Mac face in the dock. Click the Network icon. Can your Mac see the other computers? If that have the sharing setup properly, you should be able to.
On your PCs, you may need to go throough the "add Network Place" thing. For the location you will need to use the IP address that was assigned to the Mac.
If everything looks fine, or at least better than it did (LOL!), then you can address the Airport issue.
So how does it look at this point?
One thing I would like to recommend is the following book:
Mac OS X tiger Edition, The Missing Manual. The author is David Pogue, and it is part of the O'Reilly Press series. There are even screen shots of the way to setup XP computers to connect to Macs.
As far as the Airport is concerned: first, shut down your Mac and disconnect the ethernet. Now power on your Mac. Turn on Airport again, and open System Preferences. Make sure it is set to use Airport. Now click configure. Make sure it shows the Airport card settings, then set all the settings as before regarding DHCP and so on. That should do it.
ckai - Jul 26, 2005 - 11:25 pm
The good news is the ethernet cable worked a treat. I plugged it in and the Mac saw the Dell and the Dell saw the mac.
Still having issues with the wireless though. It's still not getting the right IP address. I know now this is the issue (the ethernet cable got the right IP range etc).
You mentioned earlier about ad hoc etc. Could this have anything to do with it if it's not set right? If so, how would I change it?
You have been an absolute top help and I really appreciate it. With Windows I can dig around and sort everything out but I feel like a novice in Mac, so I thank you for you simple explainations.
If we can't get the AirPort to work we know the cable works so we will just by a longer cable. But we have to give the wireless a chance. It'll feel left out if we don't (LOL)
Cameron
Still having issues with the wireless though. It's still not getting the right IP address. I know now this is the issue (the ethernet cable got the right IP range etc).
You mentioned earlier about ad hoc etc. Could this have anything to do with it if it's not set right? If so, how would I change it?
You have been an absolute top help and I really appreciate it. With Windows I can dig around and sort everything out but I feel like a novice in Mac, so I thank you for you simple explainations.
If we can't get the AirPort to work we know the cable works so we will just by a longer cable. But we have to give the wireless a chance. It'll feel left out if we don't (LOL)
Cameron
baldprof - Jul 27, 2005 - 5:48 am
If you navigate to your main Applications folder, then go to the Utilities foldr, there are two programs, one of which is the Airport Administration Utility, and the other is the Airport Setup Assistant. I believe the setup Assistant is the one you would want to use. You might just have to zero out the settings on the Airport card to set it up correctly. Either the card is not cunctioning correctly, or it is setup incorrectly.
By now you know how to change the Network Preferences to set the Mac to use the Airporrt card instead of the ethernet. What you could try would be to set it back to using Airport, then click on the little Aiport symbol which will be in the status bar at the uppr right portion of the screen (it looks like a series of ever widening arcs). Turn Airport back on. Then ask it to join yoour network. It's possible that it is picking up the wireless signal from one of your other computers instead of the router. Can it see your network, that is does it's name show up? If it doesn't then there may be something wrong with the card or it's settings.
This is when you would run the Setup Assistant to put the card back in what is called "infrastructure mode". I don't remember exactly on which screen you would do this. Sorry.
If this attempt fails, then there are two things to consider regarding your router. Do you have encryption turned on? If so, then the encryption method should match that of the Airport card. Your Airport card can use WPA, which is a newer method, although it can work with the older WEP method, which require entering a password.
Also, have you checked to see if there's a firmware upgrade for that router? I have had other clients who found that a firmware upgrade would cure the problem.
If the router has the latest firmware, and the encryption is either turned off or set properly, and you have set the Airport card to operate in infrastructure mode, and you still can't get the correct IP address, I would call Applecare. You are still within the initial 90 window of free telephoine support. It's possible the Airport card is defective (not that common but it is possible).
By now you know how to change the Network Preferences to set the Mac to use the Airporrt card instead of the ethernet. What you could try would be to set it back to using Airport, then click on the little Aiport symbol which will be in the status bar at the uppr right portion of the screen (it looks like a series of ever widening arcs). Turn Airport back on. Then ask it to join yoour network. It's possible that it is picking up the wireless signal from one of your other computers instead of the router. Can it see your network, that is does it's name show up? If it doesn't then there may be something wrong with the card or it's settings.
This is when you would run the Setup Assistant to put the card back in what is called "infrastructure mode". I don't remember exactly on which screen you would do this. Sorry.
If this attempt fails, then there are two things to consider regarding your router. Do you have encryption turned on? If so, then the encryption method should match that of the Airport card. Your Airport card can use WPA, which is a newer method, although it can work with the older WEP method, which require entering a password.
Also, have you checked to see if there's a firmware upgrade for that router? I have had other clients who found that a firmware upgrade would cure the problem.
If the router has the latest firmware, and the encryption is either turned off or set properly, and you have set the Airport card to operate in infrastructure mode, and you still can't get the correct IP address, I would call Applecare. You are still within the initial 90 window of free telephoine support. It's possible the Airport card is defective (not that common but it is possible).
ckai - Jul 27, 2005 - 8:11 pm
Thank you my good man! You are brilliant!
The upgrade of the routers firmware was the answer. It's funny how Mac show up the problems with things more than Windows computers since the Windows computers connected fine to the wireless network.
I would never have guessed to upgrade the firmware and instead would have called Apple saying their AirPort card was buggered.
Once again mate, cheers for your time, patience and help with a Mac newbie. Very much appreciated.
Cameron
The upgrade of the routers firmware was the answer. It's funny how Mac show up the problems with things more than Windows computers since the Windows computers connected fine to the wireless network.
I would never have guessed to upgrade the firmware and instead would have called Apple saying their AirPort card was buggered.
Once again mate, cheers for your time, patience and help with a Mac newbie. Very much appreciated.
Cameron
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